Ricky Holland Vanished

Below is the transcript from the Nancy Grace Show that aired tonight on CNN Headline News. I have only included the parts of the transcript that deal with Ricky’s case. The full show transcript can be read here.

I am glad that the Nancy Grace Show finally decided to cover this case. I only wish that they had seen fit to cover it before Ricky’s body was recovered.

“…Also tonight: A precious 7-year-old boy from Michigan went missing and had a tragic end to his short life. Now his adoptive parents face charges of killing Ricky Holland. Tonight, live to Michigan to track down the case, here on NANCY GRACE.

Good evening, everybody. I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell, sitting in for Nancy Grace. Tonight, a heart-breaking story of 7-year-old Michigan boy Ricky Holland, who went missing for six months. Then the tragic discovery of Ricky`s body, and later, his adoptive parents are accused of his murder.[...]“

“…(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The injuries to Ricky`s body, in conjunction with his sudden bizarre disappearance and his discovery in a remote area wrapped in plastic bags, support a conclusion that his death was the result of harmful volitional actions committed by another or others.

The preponderance of our evidence in our investigation leads to a conclusion of homicide by unspecified means for the cause and homicide as the manner of Ricky Holland`s death.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell sitting in tonight for Nancy Grace. Tonight, the tragic story of Ricky Holland, the young boy who saw more than a lifetime of suffering before his premature death.

Ricky`s first set of parents failed him. And then, at the age of seven, his second set of parents, the two people who adopted him, are charged with killing him. Let`s go right out to “Detroit News” reporter Karen Bouffard in Mason, Michigan, with the very latest on this case — Karen?

Karen, can you hear us?

KAREN BOUFFARD, REPORTER, “DETROIT NEWS”: Hi, Jane. Yes, I can.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: What`s the latest? What happened today in court?

BOUFFARD: Well, today was the third day of testimony in the preliminary examination. And there were four witnesses for the prosecution. All four of them were employees of the Jackson public school system where Ricky Holland attended school before he moved to the Williamston area last spring.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, this is such a bizarre case, Sheriff Gene Wrigglesworth, the Ingham County sheriff. And I thank you, sir, for joining us.

It`s such a bizarre case, because the husband, Tim, is accusing the wife, I understand, of killing the child. And the wife, Lisa, is accusing the husband of killing the child. Which story do you believe? What do you think is the truth? Can you explain?

SHERIFF GENE WRIGGLESWORTH, INGHAM COUNTY: Well, they`re conflicting stories. The truth is going to be determined by a judge at some point in time, but there certainly is conflicting stories, as there usually is in this type of case.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. But you`re talking about two wildly different stories. You`re talking about a man who says his wife killed the child, and you`re talking a woman who says her husband killed the child, yet they`re both charged with murder.

Let`s go to the judge in this case, Rosemarie Aquilina. She is the judge presiding over the preliminary exam. How come, technically, can you explain to us how two individuals can be charged with murder in this situation?

JUDGE ROSEMARIE AQUILINA, 55TH DISTRICT COURT JUDGE: Well, because anybody who participated in a crime, such as murder, or for that matter any other crime, can be charged with the same offense.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And another bizarre…

AQUILINA: If you aide or abet.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Aide or abet, thank you, ma`am. Another bizarre aspect of all of this is that this couple, Tim and Lisa Holland, on July 2nd, when they say the child disappeared, called 911, and then later kind of went public, and encouraged hundreds of volunteers to search for this child, and hundreds of people did throughout the hot summer, some of them singing lullabies as they went, hoping to lure the child out of the bushes.

Let`s hear what Tim Holland, the adoptive father, actually said this past summer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TIM HOLLAND, ACCUSED OF ADOPTED SON`S MURDER: My wife and I would like to thank the Ingham County Sheriff`s Department for everything that they have done for us, and especially thank all of the volunteers that have come out to take time away from their families to search for our son.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Psychoanalyst Bethany Marshall, authorities believe at the time that he was saying that he already knew that his son was dead. What kind of a person is capable of doing that? And I have to tell you, there`s tremendous anger in the community…

MARSHALL: Of course.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: … among the people who really, really gave their heart and soul to this search.

MARSHALL: Well, an abuser. And we know that 80 percent of children who die from child abuse and neglect are killed by the parents, not neighbors, not social workers, not teachers, by the parents. And both parents fit the profile of somebody who can murder a child, and I`ll tell you how.

When a child is murdered by a mother, usually it`s maltreatment. And we know this little boy was being malnourished and underfed. We know that from a neighbor`s testimony. When the father kills the child, usually it`s physical abuse.

And we know from the very same neighbor that the father had called the little boy a Ted Bundy. And so, I mean, a little kid is not a killer, so you can guess the father is attributing his own destructive impulses to the child.

He also said to the neighbor, “We can`t get pets, because this little boy would kill them,” so there`s confusion between self and other in the minds of the father. So I think, you know, what kind of father could offer this testimony, I mean, or say this to the public? I`d say, what kind of dad would call a little kid a Ted Bundy? An abuser.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And, Bethany, that`s a very good question. So we have with us tonight the attorney for Lisa Holland, the wife, Mike Nichols.

Good evening, sir. Thank you for joining us.

What does Lisa say? This is such a convoluted case. And apparently, they were presenting a united front until something happened and it was an incident with a hair dryer. Can you explain, please?

MIKE NICHOLS, ATTORNEY FOR LISA HOLLAND: Well, Jane, I`m not going to comment on what Lisa has to say.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK, then I`ll tell you what happened with the hair dryer. This is what I understand. You can correct me if I`m wrong.

NICHOLS: OK.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tim accused Lisa of throwing an electric hair dryer at him when he was in the shower, OK? And then she was later arrest and charged with assault with a deadly weapon. And the next day, Lisa told police that her husband had killed Ricky.

NICHOLS: Jane, that felonious assault charge related to the hair dryer was dismissed. And at this point, we`re in a preliminary examination on an open murder charge. We`ve been put on notice that our clients, Tim and Lisa Holland, are going to — there`s a bind over that will be sought on a child abuse charge in the first degree.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: But let me just say this…

NICHOLS: That`s what we`re dealing with.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: … you`re saying that she`s innocent. What is her explanation of what happened? Tell me your side of the story.

NICHOLS: Well, Jane, all I can tell you is that we`re going to try this case in the courtroom. The one point that I want to make is — Bethany made a comment, an analysis related to malnourishment on the part of Lisa Holland.

I guess the MRPCs, the Michigan rules of professional conduct, would let me respond to something that I think is inaccurate in analyzing evidence.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, go ahead and respond, because we`re running out of time. We want to hear your side.

NICHOLS: Well, what I would say, Jane, is that the testimony that I heard today is not that that child was malnourished. There was testimony that he was skinny and that he was short, but the testimony that I heard, in fact, from one of the school officials was that he didn`t seem to be malnourished at all.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Lauren Lake, defense attorney, what do you think? When a neighbor, we had read in news reports, said that this youngster suddenly surfaced inside her home and was in the refrigerator looking for food. And she fed him two peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, and he said, “I don`t want to go home. I don`t want to go home.” And she said, “Well, you can`t stay here,” but she was a kind lady. But that sounds like a hungry kid, not a psychotic kid.

LAKE: Well, Jane, you`re right. And this is sickening. This case is from my home state, and I`m just sickened by it, to tell the truth.

But, unfortunately, I have to put on my defense hat and say, even if they were malnourishing the child, we still don`t know which of these two people actually killed the child. And as a defense attorney, it just amazes me sometimes that your clients can be their own worst enemy, because had neither one of those two said a word, there was really very little evidence in this case to convict them on, being that the child`s body was so decomposed when it was found.

So here you`ve got them saying, “No, you did it,” “No, no, you did it,” and it`s just the silliest game. And it`s going to end in defeat for one, if not both of them.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: It would be silly were it not so tragic. I agree with you entirely.

Let`s go to Dr. Larry Kobilinsky, forensic scientist. Where did they find the body? I understand the body was in a plastic bag. What was the condition in? Who led them to the body?

KOBILINSKY: Well, I can only tell you, Jane, that this body was approximately seven months sitting in a plastic bag in a ditch. And the fact of the matter is that, after such a prolonged period of time, there is no longer soft tissue; all you have are skeletal remains. And that is precisely the reason that the medical examiner could not determine the cause of death. Matter of death…

VELEZ-MITCHELL: But weren`t there fractures? Weren`t there fractures on the bones?

KOBILINSKY: Indeed there were, and that tells the tale. Not only did the medical examiner find fractures, he found different kinds of fractures, fresh fractures that were unhealed, and fractures that were older and in a state of healing. In fact, the fresh fractures were extensive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And what does that show?

KOBILINSKY: Well, it shows that this child was abused, physically abused over a lengthy period of time. It didn`t happen just at the time of death or a few days before, but a lengthy period of time this child`s bones were broken.

Now, if the child had been perhaps punched in the abdomen and soft tissue damage resulted in hemorrhage, that could have been the cause of death. We will never know the cause of death.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Because of the decomposition.

KOBILINSKY: That`s correct.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Thank you, Doctor.

And we have to stress, of course, these two individuals have only been charged. They do have the presumption of innocence. And we did attempt to contact Tim Holland`s attorney. We invited him on the show. He politely declined, saying he was very busy working on the case, which is certainly understandable. We`re going to have more on it in a second.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have a recollection of the mark on Ricky that caused your attention (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It looked like a burn. It was a pretty good size. It was kind of like black and blue.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were you concerned for Ricky Holland`s safety at all?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, I was.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What was (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I thought she might have been mean to him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell sitting in tonight for Nancy Grace. We`re talking about the sad, short life of Ricky Holland and his untimely death at the age of seven. And now each adoptive parent accusing the other of killing him.

Let`s go to reporter for “Detroit News,” Karen Bouffard who`s been tracking this case. Apparently, a hammer factors into this. Can you tell us about that?

BOUFFARD: Yes, Jane. In this swear-to report that sheriff`s deputies gave to the judge when they requested the warrant for the arrest of the Hollands for the murder of Ricky Holland, they gave a lot of information that they say was provided to them by Tim Holland.

According to that court testimony, Tim Holland had gone to the prosecuting attorney and had told them that Lisa had hit Ricky with a hammer and killed him with two blows to the head with a hammer. And then he had instructed him to bury the body, and that he had gone and buried the body. And after providing this information to the prosecutors and the sheriff`s deputies, he led them actually to the place where Ricky was buried. And this is how they found the body.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, do we know what Tim`s story is? Do we know what Lisa`s story is, rather? I mean, because we have Lisa`s attorney on tonight, but he is very restricted in what he can talk about. Have we heard any reports about the other allegation, what Lisa is saying Tim did, aside from disposing of the body?

BOUFFARD: Right. There`s very little information about what Lisa`s story is. In the report by the officers, it just says that she had blamed it on Tim, but really didn`t provide any details as far as what her story is.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And let`s hear and see Lisa emotionally speaking out this past summer, encouraging hundreds of people to search for her boy, at a time when prosecutors say that she knew all along that he was already dead.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LISA HOLLAND, ACCUSED OF MURDERING ADOPTED SON: I don`t want anybody else to have to go through this. It plays on your emotions. It plays havoc on your family, because everybody is upset.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Mike Nichols, you`re the attorney for Lisa Holland. I understand you`re restricted in what you can say. But, I mean, here she is speaking on camera, crying, hundreds of people, 600 at one point, searching through lakes, and bushes, and everything for this child. And prosecutors say she knew that he was dead at that time.

What can you say in defense of your client about those statements? Because this community is quite angry that they were deceived.

NICHOLS: Well, Jane, I`m asking you and your viewers and the community not to prejudge Lisa Holland. She`s innocent in the eyes of our system. You know, people can react to situations and events many, many different ways, and the point of what I want to convey is Lisa Holland is innocent until proven guilty.

There has been rafts, volumes of paper written about what she said, what Tim has purportedly said, things that I heard Karen Bouffard talk about relative to a hammer. None of that is in evidence yet.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, they have other children, four other children. I understand that three of them are Ricky`s biological siblings and then one is their biological child. What`s the status of those children right now? Who`s taking care of them?

NICHOLS: The other four children are in protective custody. They have been placed through Michigan`s Department of Human Services. They are, I believe living — two siblings with one paternal relative, and two siblings with another paternal relative.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Former federal prosecutor Michele Martinez, we`re running out of time. Did this child fall through the cracks?

MARTINEZ: Absolutely. And it`s a tragedy, but it happens all the time. You know, foster children do get killed, and people in the system do make mistakes. It`s tragic, but hopefully justice will be served and the parents will be convicted.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: It`s so sad, because some of the neighbors were saying that this child would show up at their doorstep saying that he wanted to stay there. He didn`t want to go home.

And, of course, those people can`t take the child in. Some of them did call protective services. And obviously, we`re going to find out what, if anything, was done by the powers that be to protect this child. It really is a disgrace. It`s a beautiful little boy, and he should be alive today. He should be alive having peanut butter and jelly sandwiches. And it`s a tragedy.[...]“

“…(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: … did receive a letter from his biological mother asking that she be given his remains. We had a number of people call the office and say they wanted to bury Ricky, they wanted to do something in Ricky`s memory.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: We are talking about little Ricky Holland`s, whose badly decomposed body was found in a plastic bag. Let`s go straight out to Judge Rosemarie Aquilina, who is the presiding judge in this case.

What happens next with these two adoptive parents, ma`am?

AQUILINA: Well, we have about five more days of hearing, and then either the matter will be dismissed, if there`s not probable cause, or it will be bound over to circuit court.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, let me go to Karen Bouffard…

AQUILINA: There are about…

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m sorry, ma`am? Go ahead.

AQUILINA: I was just going to say there are probably 20 more witnesses that have to be heard.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So it`s kind of like almost like a mini-trial, in a way.

AQUILINA: It is, but it`s one simply to find probable cause that the crime was committed and probable cause if the individuals who are accused did the crime.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Karen Bouffard, reporter for the “Detroit News,” I`ve read that a lot of people in the area are furious because they spent so much time, effort, money, dogs, helicopters, boats, you name it, searching for this child for a prolonged period of time, for months. What`s the mood in the community?

BOUFFARD: That`s correct. Well, I think it`s a mixture of sadness and grief over the loss of Ricky, and just complete dismay that this sweet little child was murdered, and also outrage that it was allowed to happen, that there were safe protection workers that were aware that he was being abused, a lot of questions about why wasn`t he removed from the home, a lot of questions about his remaining siblings that continued to live with the Hollands until after Ricky`s body was discovered.

So there are a lot of questions, a lot of sadness, and a lot of outrage.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, thank you for joining us. And as we wrap up, I can tell you one neighbor said, quote, that this boy told them, quote, “I ran away because the people don`t want me. They want a baby.” And that was what this young boy said to a neighbor, according to that neighbor.[...]